View Full Version : Crisis Time..well is it?
I have thought long and hard about paintball in the last few months..well in reality since Christmas..and I got to thinking.
As lots of guys who know me know that paintball is my business ,my love..ok and the wife too.
I read an article that MikeE posted Re Jo Pitts write up from back when.
How it reads is how it still is..well to apoint.
I believe Paintballs are as cheap as they should be..Now thats coming from a players view as when I play I pay the same as any one else when playing any Tourney in NZ.
Can anybody give me genuine reasons why our Tourney scene is weakening?
I dont want Paint prices nor Costs as these are always going to there.
But what are we as Players / Field Ops doing wrong.
Are we targeting guys too early?
Recball/ Milsim to coin a phrase seems to be going strong ..Reccys/Milsimers dont all tell me your stories .
Tourney players..the guys I play against..How do we curb the slow down.
I know its business when it comes to holding events and good on any one holding one.
Quite a few of us on this board know how it feels to go to an event with 18 plus teams entered..Paintball coming out your ears..Thats how it should.
I dont think its a regional thing ..although I have noticed a decline in teams from the Upper North Island..why is this?.
I have guys coming thru the ranks in Dunedin and I wants these guys to experiance the thrill and feelings I have when I attend a BIG tourney.
Believe me I tell them all the good stuff, bourbon , woman , all night parties..well bourbon..but I would like to think they could attend Tournies this year that had maximum teams..well more than what appears to be going to Wellers.
This isnt a rant..just my concerns on my game, my passion..
B2 kickin back top the ol sack o'seed 8)
NiGeFiRe
23-02-2006, 18:59
I think that we are lacking in youth development,
I think we need to unite to get funding to help grow youth development and paintball clubs.
My 5c worth
We need strong regional leadership to get clubs formed and actively recruit new players.
Grass roots is where paintball needs to grow.
Out of these clubs will grow teams etc..
ANTSMAN68
23-02-2006, 21:18
i see a big problem (just like Jono said) is that toooooooooo many people spend toooooooo long talking and posting, on the now defunct NZPB site, as opposed to actually playing. no i dont mean you b2, just people in general. i have seen too many people in charge(tournaments/message boards/teams) with old ways and ideas, and not keen to change. well a lot of that has changed in the last year or so, and like i said middle of last year 2006 will be a better year. well it will be if thats what we make it.
i think there are a lot of passionate people out there that play the game, and a lot that try really hard to do what they think is "right" for paintball but end up with permanent brain damage from beating their heads against the wall of "trying to please everyone", which as we all know is impossible.
i think best thing we can all do is just keep on keeping on, carry on suppporting tournaments as much as we can. Easter is shaping up to be a good one. i am so looking forward to catching up with a lot of teams that i havnt seen since last easter, especially out of town teams like Flashpoint/chch team and Saints.i think more effort by teams probably should be put into travelling to attend out of town majors where possible, as for most major centres i think there tends to be a play where you live mentality.More expensive yes, but lack of teams at major tournaments is due to teams staying at home.simple aint it.
while i agree with Nigel that youth developement is very important, we need to encourage and SUPPORT where possible the existing older teams by committing and turning up to tournaments,,, because without them, new teams will have no one to play against....
Well said Ants.
Its true that its easier to stay home and play than travel..But thats not growing Paintball "Tourney wise"
Lets look regional..
East Coast Nth Is.? Teams..is paintball dead over there?
Roto..had 3 teams once upon a time..yes I know ppl move on..wheres the remainder tho?
Auck downtown..Cept the Saints & HSR? who else
Of course I will throw in the Sth Is..
West Coast SI..Hillbillies..Reccys thats it.
Nelson..imported ChcH boyz I believe
ChCh hot n cold
Dunedin..New guys coming thru but again Recball rules
Invers..a couple of prospects for B2
So yes Regional is a good way to target this dilemma.
But ultimately we must provide events for these guys to aim for..events that they can look fwd to and see lots of Ballers attending..team names that they can relate to NZ wise.
On a personal note I have always enjoyed Flashpoints going head to head with the Saints..yes it maybe a old school thing ..but out of all I have ever seen in ball..Rik Goldsworthy has always impressed me with his hardnosed , No Bs way of playing..even his tantrums have made me .
smile :lol:
I think this year will get better..Just we all need to dig deep and not be complacent and leave it up to the next guy to sort out.
Cya in Wellers Ants
B2 8)
Shadow Hunter
24-02-2006, 01:50
What about getting out to some secondary school/uni's and doing demo's about the sport, how can you introduce peopel to a sport they don't know about.
B2 mentionted youth development, and it sound like a great idea. from the post i have been reading over the past few weeks all of you are very switched, well why don't the VET's get together for an organised brainstorming session.
From what i have seen i think the biggest problem is the lack of organistion. Human beings need structure for them to function propley, just a thought..........
Cheers
Johno (shadow Hunter)
Dodgy_Matt
24-02-2006, 07:46
I used to love the sport but I got sick to death with all the cheating... Yes I know most of it came from the guys I played closely with... but it wasn’t only them....
Some of the other crap I got sick of was the Elitist attitude of the older players. "I’ve been playing for 400 years and am far better than you will ever be" All that shit just fucked me off....
This is meant to be a Sport, you are not god's remember that.
I used to love the sport but I got sick to death with all the cheating... Yes I know most of it came from the guys I played closely with... but it wasn’t only them....
Some of the other crap I got sick of was the Elitist attitude of the older players. "I’ve been playing for 400 years and am far better than you will ever be" All that shit just fucked me off....
This is meant to be a Sport, you are not god's remember that.
Im sorry you feel this way Matt.
If by definition Im one of those "older guys"and I know I am..I arent any God cept in front of my fans and Wife;)
But seriously and dont read this the wrong way.
The Older set in ball have whats called stickability
As much as it pains me to say it..Older set and by that I think you mean players who have played for a few years to apoint have been the back bone of Paintball. well maybe not all but quite afew have and still are trying to grow the sport.
We have done the hard yards if any has to be done..any sport is the same.
Bit like walking..when you first learn you fall over..Now if you gave up cos your mother said you can walk one day just like your brother etc..you may just say NO I cant and never walk again..Of course we know that doesnt happen cos we all eventually walk..and then run..
Same application...different angle.
But to the more pressing things.
Yes I agree on Shadow Hunters thoughts. Organisation
Paintballers are as we all know..notoriously bad at getting sorted, paying fees etc.
Events need structure..Need a Manager.
Now this isnt a swipe at NZPL..But Somebody has to take full control..Leaving it to players is noble but I feel unrealistic.
I like the NZPL's views etc..Just I think players wait for a leader to be the MAN in charge.
Either way from down in my part of Paradise I will be attending Wellers, Auk, Roto and local events.
Dont feel bad about ball Matt..just get even.
B2
Krazy Mike
24-02-2006, 11:14
If by definition Im one of those "older guys" B2, by any definition you're one of those older guys :twisted:
Yes I agree on Shadow Hunters thoughts. Organisation
Paintballers are as we all know..notoriously bad at getting sorted, paying fees etc.
Events need structure..Need a Manager.
Now this isnt a swipe at NZPL..But Somebody has to take full control..Leaving it to players is noble but I feel unrealistic.
I like the NZPL's views etc..Just I think players wait for a leader to be the MAN in charge.
I agree completely, which is why most organisations have "early bird specials" (or as they should be known lethagy tax) where if you sign up/pay up front you don't get hit with a late fee.
Paintballers wait. There will be teams, possibably up to the day before the event, still deciding if they want to play. This won't change until we have too many teams to be able to attend a single event and it becomes a first in type event. That won't happen until we get more teams ... Catch 22
But We need events organised ahead of time, not right down to the wire so that people know and can decide if they want to attend the event. There have been too many events where details are not out until only weeks before.
Mike
Thank you Mike for pointing out the "older tag" you will keep :twisted:
B2
Krazy Mike
24-02-2006, 12:08
Thank you Mike for pointing out the "older tag" you will keep :twisted:
B2
Why do I get the feelin' I'm gonna get some B2 extra luvin' come easter.
That'll just be in the stageing ;)
Does that mean I'm a "younger" player :-P
I've been talking to G a fair bit about the nzpl, having done some designs for them.
He says he is aware of the need for a leader, but that at the moment with his business as it is he's having to put all his energy into it rather than paintball. Unfortunately, with the NZPL having been his baby, this means that organising stuff for both the NZPL and the Blackgats is going to be difficult. I don't think he'll mind me saying that it'll be about six months before he can start putting in the time and effort required to really help it take off.
I've offered to do what I can - I have a marketing and management degree and can design any banners/ref uniforms/flyers/website/whatever. Only problem is that I have no experience with paintball itself...
You are a young man in a old body MikeE.
Burnt Toast
24-02-2006, 14:57
10 cents worth? .
Crisis?, personally I don't think so.
Opportunity, I think would be a better word.
I agree with Ants allot on this subject. It does seem to be allot of talk by many and action by few.
Having played for less than a year, I try to keep allot of comments to myself, basicly because I don't know allot of people nor do I know the history.
I think the tournie side of things may be on the decline because people don't want to orgainse something, and then get knocked back for doing it.
Also without half decent Refs (and I'm not knocking anyone here), the cheating is hard to clamp down on, and the result there is pissed off players who turn around and just go fuck that why would I bother, and who could blame them.
The game of PB has evolved leaps and bounds over the last 2-3 years, from people pouring money into the game and it's growing popularity, a reasourse we don't have down here in dear old NZ.
This needs to be realised.
Iv organised events before (mountain biking DH/XC) and for the most part people love the event because I tried to make it as up to date as I could, some people knocked it but you get that.
Id love to organise an event/series, but I still have allot to learn about the game.
maybe next year once I have allot more game experence, and Iv learnt what people like and don't like i'll be able to give it a go. (x-ball lite seems to gaining popularity)
I look forward to that.
I don't like looking backwards, forwards is the way, if you have to look back, your fucked anyway :lol:
Not sure how you mean Opportunity.
We have set events for the year..yes they are the Big 3 to coin a phrase..But its the decline Im really on about. The decline in Teams entering these events.
Youth development is one answer..but that to me is a long term view.
What Im aiming at is the "now" problem..The problem with the lack of teams.
I see younger guys get into ball and by younger I mean High school age guys. I dont feel the cost is prohibitive..Its ppl who want to play must prioritise thier funds as such.
Reality is a harsh task master and as most of us know...once you start into ball it can hit home really quickly how costly Paintball can be.
But even then thats not answering my question. Yes I talk to myself
I look hard and deep into the pysche of Paintball in NZ.
To me EGO's no not the gun but ego's as in mines bigger than yours, plays a huge part in how our Paintball is moulded in NZ.
I know I may sound like Im rambling but im looking for solutions and by throwing out these thoughts may spark some ppl to think about Paintball and come up with new ideas.
Simple , sensible ideas....As a Paintballer I realise we are simple creatures.
We run at one another and shoot each other..nothing too damn complicated really..But it seems to be.
B2 8)
Burnt Toast
24-02-2006, 16:15
Ok, I see what you mean now.
It took me a long time to write that, which is why I'v missed the point.
Well the teams that are out there already, could start supporting their local feild more (and I'm not saying allot of you don't), training and playing at the local feild would raise awareness of the tournie style of play.
E.g some noob watching, thinks shit that looks like fun.
Teams could crack a deal with the feild (paint, walk on fees, air, what ever) to get them out there on a regular basis.
Allot of people I know think paintball is me running round in the bushes, people just don't know about it.
Players could bring friends, before I started PB, only two people I knew played and one of them was Dodgy Matt, yer I know, never mind. :lol:
Your right about costs, it's not that bad.
I ment opportunity, as in lets move forward, people keep going on about the bad stuff.
waylander
24-02-2006, 17:43
Paintball is to expensive for high schoolers to play competitively. They don't have 1000 to spend on getting competitive gear.
It ust won't work. Nz is to small. We don't have a bunch of rich people where their parents can finance their paintball habits like they do in the states.
We have to companys/ fields that make enough to sponser TEAMS (plural) to a point where they can play regularly.
Just for clarity B2
Right now COMING to the 5's we have about 6 regular teams
Menace
menace blue
pirates
xxx
chronic
sinister (I think mgiht be a diff name)
And usally a throw together team or 2
A couple more not so regular teams.
also hsr and some diff teams play regularly at actions for the xball.
The older guys are arrogant for the most part but the thing is they can be. They have been playing for 300 years so logic would say they are better. They just play the sport with a little to much passion which I can understand. They love the game and half the fun of a game is winning and being good. So when they don't get that half there not so aggreable.
Water Boy
24-02-2006, 18:16
I play. I dont have a job. My parents dont pay for my stuff... but i do try to get my cash doing random stuff....
the_distant_one
24-02-2006, 18:34
THe first thing that comes to my mind (and I am by no means an expert) is that there is firtsly no leadership for the sport. s someone said above someone needs to take a lead role and liasion with all teams and feild operators so that there is one person/body sorting everything out and organizing the events.
secondly.... there is no marketing of the sport at all. Even the feild opeartors have little or no marketing happening. Take for example Adventure Paintball in papakura. I lived there for for about 2 months after it opoend and didnt know it exsisted. Talking to near 50 odd people at cricket training last night out in karaka maybe 10 people (all students of the local college) knew that it exsisted. so hopefully I have generated abit more revenue for ya ;)
Thirdly.... Cheating!!!! WTF is up with that.... now being a newbie I dont really know about all the cheating styles (and yes I did read ya ramping article MikeyE) but if people love the sport so uch why would you cheat its just rediculous. With out anyone organizing the whole scene nothing can be applied nationally so at the moment us as ballers basically have to ostracise (sp?) people that cheat so that it gets learned very quickly that cheating will not be tolerated at all!!!!!!
Getting people ino the sport is a big thing once we get people turning up o the events it is fine cause I have been to two days and have been welcomed by most of the guys there therefore encouraging me to get into it.
well that would be about my 20cents
ANTSMAN68
24-02-2006, 18:49
distant one, great post!
no leadership for the sport.
exactly right, there was a governing body(nzppa) that pretty much got sideswiped into oblivion... some liked the ides some didnt,
there is no marketing of the sport at all.
correct, very little is done ,,,field ops mostly see it as dead money, not all but a lot. tournament wise, its a matter of advertising costs bigtime, who will pay?
Cheating all sports have cheaters, a lot of them are paid to play their chosen sport, and if they can get away with it they will,,, sad but true, not a good thing but thats the way it is,,, as for paintball, sure there are those that do, but i do not for a minute believe it is as bad as has been purported recently.... blown way out of proportion?imo yes.
i think theres been a lot of doom and gloom on the paintball boards in nz lately, which i think is a big problem in itself. more positivity and turning up to tournaments to play ball is whats needed. a lot of people like to talk the talk , not so many walk the walk as well,,,,
Ants
ANTSMAN68
24-02-2006, 18:50
ok ok so im not so flash with the quote function in the above post :)
the_distant_one
24-02-2006, 18:54
wiv the cheating thing... now I have only been looking to get into touney side for about 4 or so weeks and that is the main thing I have heard about is how there are lots of cheaters.... o yes positivity is much needed.
Also with the feild ops there must be money in it in someway.... has no1 ever gone to big compaine for sponorship??? first three brands that come to mind Red Bull, V and Vodafone are always looking to od something different.
Also with the feild ops there must be money in it in someway.... has no1 ever gone to big compaine for sponorship??? first three brands that come to mind Red Bull, V and Vodafone are always looking to od something different.
Sponsorship is a two way thing... tell me what these corporates are going to get if there is no marketing of the sport as you mentioned above.
You need to think of a "hook" in order to get corporate sponsorship. Rule of thumb is that ever sponsorship dollar should bring back between $5 and $10 to the sponsoring company.
(yeah I do a bit of sponsorship stuff @ work too)
the_distant_one
24-02-2006, 19:00
Also with the feild ops there must be money in it in someway.... has no1 ever gone to big compaine for sponorship??? first three brands that come to mind Red Bull, V and Vodafone are always looking to od something different.
Sponsorship is a two way thing... tell me what these corporates are going to get if there is no marketing of the sport as you mentioned above.
You need to think of a "hook" in order to get corporate sponsorship. Rule of thumb is that ever sponsorship dollar should bring back between $5 and $10 to the sponsoring company.
(yeah I do a bit of sponsorship stuff @ work too)
yeah it is a two way thing indeed. though Ireckon pitched the right way at leat one company would probably take it up as a investment kind of... so may even help with the whole marketing side of it.
though o course the main thing is to get the leadership issues sorted
I think it is because of al the bullshit between the different groups or players. Take the PBNZ forum for example, that shut down because people argue way too much, usually over just about anything. Some people just need to learn to swallow their pride, put aside their differences and just play paintball.
I don't think players should be given too much say in how a tourny is run, they will just argue matters to death and it won't happen at all, as was the case with Roto last year....
I don't think players should be given too much say in how a tourny is run, they will just argue matters to death and it won't happen at all, as was the case with Roto last year....
Get your facts right please :-)
Roto was cancelled because there was not enough people with legal air systems to run the event legally. The organisers were not prepared to take a massive risk of allowing people with non compliant cylinders to compete at their event - as they could have been potentially liable for a $500,000 fine under the HSNO (Compressed Gases) regulations.
Nothing to do with giving players say, or agruing matters.. it was a matter of Can we run an event legally in the public eye, or can't we... simple
Guys please dont bring the "cheating" thing into this topic..thats a total thing on its own.
The PBNZ site ran its course..finished gone all over ,well the old site is..Move on.
This is about Teams, about getting more players attending events.
What is hitting me in the face is..and this is just reading these few post and that is Direction and Management.
NZPPA was the flag ship for that...to apoint.
Constructive views /ideas are welcomed..but no arguements on rules or regs.thats another forum.
B2 8)
the_distant_one
24-02-2006, 19:26
Guys please dont bring the "cheating" thing into this topic..thats a total thing on its own.
The PBNZ site ran its course..finished gone all over ,well the old site is..Move on.
This is about Teams, about getting more players attending events.
What is hitting me in the face is..and this is just reading these few post and that is Direction and Management.
NZPPA was the flag ship for that...to apoint.
Constructive views /ideas are welcomed..but no arguements on rules or regs.thats another forum.
B2 8)
sorry my bad.... it was just a point as a newbie to come in and all I heard was people biatching about everyone cheating but anyway......
maybe welly will be the place where someone has to stand up and try unite all the teams/operators. I saw a post in another thread somewhere of trying to organize the captains to come together and actually sort out whats going on
ANTSMAN68
24-02-2006, 19:26
well currently the NZPPA is still going, but i think the board/committee are all from Auckland...
and the nzpl is about to kickoff for the year with Easter coming up,
i think with all the drama in last year or two, people will likely try a lot harder to get along and wor for the good of the sport....
well currently the NZPPA is still going, but i think the board/committee are all from Auckland...
Location shouldn't make any difference... look at it this way - its a positive because its easier for them to meet and get something done.
And its only temporary while things get back off the ground again untill the next agm when members can votein a new committee.
ANTSMAN68
24-02-2006, 19:36
Mike for Prime Minister :)
pfftt.... Ants... don't make me draf this thread woefully off topic
justover
24-02-2006, 19:45
Christchurch has gone from 8-10 people attending Club days to 20-30 people joining clubdays and the numbers are growing everyweek. The club is very strong at the moment.
This has been driven by 3-4 key people ( which im not one of them )
The biggest thing I find is that if you take an interest in people the first time they play and make it a fun experience for them then they are always going to come back. You can introduce them to 3man tornaments then onto 7 mans outside your city.
Organization is a big thing with any club, no one likes to be mucked around.
My main aim for the CHCH club anyway is to make sure that people have a good time and feel welcome.
Paintball is a fun game and it should be played that way.
My 2 cents.
Burnt Toast
24-02-2006, 23:35
Paintball is to expensive for high schoolers to play competitively. They don't have 1000 to spend on getting competitive gear.
It ust won't work. Nz is to small. We don't have a bunch of rich people where their parents can finance their paintball habits like they do in the states.
We have to companys/ fields that make enough to sponser TEAMS (plural) to a point where they can play regularly.
The older guys are arrogant for the most part but the thing is they can be. They have been playing for 300 years so logic would say they are better. They just play the sport with a little to much passion which I can understand. They love the game and half the fun of a game is winning and being good. So when they don't get that half there not so aggreable.
Cost is not the issue I think, $1000 for kit might sound like allot, but try $3000-$7000 for a kid that wants to race a down hill bike, and more of them do that than play paintball. or kids at the bmx track 8-14 years old with troy lee $1000 helmets, no cost isn't the problem.
I think perants just don't want to see their kid shooting a gun at another kid and enjoying it.
As for the older arrogant guys, I'm with you on that one brother, I'm 34 and they fuck me off too.
Pull your heads in and start teaching instead of preaching ya old coots.
Shadow Hunter
25-02-2006, 00:34
I really think everyone's getting the idea, BUT THATS NOT ENOUGH. We need to stop talking and start working to get NZ paintball out there so corproate sponcers will even have a second glance.
everyone seems to have skills they can contribute and as a whole there would be a very small work load. Talk is one thing but we need to see actions. I get over to NZ in 3 weeks so if anyone wants to meet up and try and get some procedures in place email me or chat to me on MSN
Paintball is to expensive for high schoolers to play competitively. They don't have 1000 to spend on getting competitive gear.
It ust won't work. Nz is to small. We don't have a bunch of rich people where their parents can finance their paintball habits like they do in the states.
That's not true at all.. When I was Racing Motor Cross there were more young people (intermediate to high school) Racing then us older guy's.. Now I would figure MX would be a shit load more expensive to do then Paint Ball due to the Price of your Bike and Gear (They ALL had the Bling Gear) so I think it come's down to getting younger people more aware of Paint Ball..
As said above some my mate's think I'm going away at Easter time for the 7 Man's and playing in the Bush!! They haven't seen the Speed Ball Tounament side of Paint Ball before so it need's to be pushed out into the public with some sort of advertising so to speak..
We only have to look at what pauls achieved in getting public awareness of Sup Air style paintball in malaysia.
Hes only had two years to do this, but there are now hundreds of thousands of people who are interested in the sport. Its a case of making use of the PR available and running with it.
The problem in NZ (and I am going to make a massive generalisation here) is we have lots of kids, and joe blogs workers playing - but not many well connected professionals involved who can draw upon personal contacts.
Once you get within the inner circle (i.e. know who are the right people in corporates to approach, who are friendly in the media, who are the right people in govt) we can start to becone more proactive in the marketing. We need to build the foundations first tho - theres no point in a massive marketing blitz if the product isn';t read y for market first.
blah blah blah friggin' blah...
do any of you guys ever find time to play paintball? :P
the long term success of this sport requires everyone to:
be nice to everyone (esp newbs)
dont cheat (gav)
and turn up to/support as many paintball practices, trainings, events and organisations as is humanly possible.. oh and try not to bitch too much or people will stop trying.
support for teams/individuals who are pushing the envelope internationally has gotta be mentioned also.. even if it may seem at cost to local events i.e. Menace traveling to oz events rather than wellington, or last year some Hybrid members missing local events due to x-ball commitments, its these guys who really put in the effort and spend the big bucks to push themselves to and beyond the level of paintball that nz is currently at. They then bring this experience back and pass it onto others (whether nationally or regionally), adding to the future potential of all nz ballers to be truly internationally competitive.
or something like that anyway
Stat
Saints
Blackgats
Wellington Hybrid
Team Running With Scissors
MegaSnipers
(sitting on his sack of seed)
I'd be with Mike, we have to think this through.
I can honestly see paintball on TV; with proper numbers of cameras and decent editing/replays/stats/whatever it could be very watchable for the average Joe (since it's not that good to watch in RL without a jumbo screen).
That wont happen until we have something decent to show. I'm basically echoing mike here I think, but it's true, if we market this sport right and have the right foundation and management there's no reason why it can't go huge. Once we have a decent event good to go we could invite some media people along, or even send them some footage of our own if it's decent to peak their interest.
We're on the right track already, if we can get some good ref training kicked off for the NZPL (which will filter down to other events), run something well organised and fun, and get lots of kids involved like Marty is going hard at, then we'll end up going places.
Two Guns
25-02-2006, 13:16
Paintball on TV?
Apart from the odd 5 min spot on some sports show once in a blue moon there won't be totally paintball shows on TV. For one there is not the huge following out there that many seem to think there is. Sure in the states there is how mnay billion trillion players? Got news for you champ, this isn't the states, we are a small island nation on the backside on the world.
Secondly, shows cost money to make. Production costs etc etc. TV companies don't make shows, they buy them off production companies, you want paintball on TV and crappy ratings then go talk to to Touchdown TV they are the ones who make the Celebrity Treasure island, and all those sings stars dancing stars programmes that suck.
Paintball is what you make it. You don't want cheaters, kick them in the arse.
You want good events, put the effort in to make them good.
You want paintball in NZ to be noticed world wide? Put paintball in a NZ context, don't make it a carbon copy of the same shit the states do. Make NZ paintball NZ.
I'm not saying hakas, and spearchuckers. Do it our own way.
as for paintball on TV, I think the way to do it would be backwards.
does anyone else remember that 'sports stars doing another sport' show last year (I remember the Kendalls doing Kendo and and Steve Gerny doing horse riding (one of the challanges was paintball target shooting)). next one of those shows comes around a well organised paintball field offers a week training and then 'tournament' style ball at the end to see who goes thorugh (X-lite or that ilk) (even if the tourny players job in it).
this would have the advantage of:
cheap big name association
showing it can be done by the 'man' on the street
showing there is more to PB than Gats and Camo
if a lady plays too, showing that ladies can be equally competitive in the sport
and an hour or so (and promos) on paintball in a positive light
then once the show is done the network may possibly throw in a 'remember this team, well....' piece as a filler
Steven
Shadow Hunter
25-02-2006, 18:01
ok ok lets not get ahead of ourselves.......
we have to crawl before we can walk. don't get me wrong TV is a great idea but we need to develop the sport before we can even consider something that dramatic.
just a thought
Cheers
Johno
What I asked firstly was this. How do we get more teams in to Tournies and where are all our NZ teams...that what I asked initially.
But out of all this I see positives steps....I see no bickering or argueing..constructive views are good, destructive wont be tolerated.
We are all in the same boat so to speak..Paintball grows we all benifit..thats Players, Field Ops, Suppliers everybody.
B2 on top of the ONLY sack o'seed 'hands off please" Dont fondle it ..I know you want to;)
waylander
26-02-2006, 01:14
Younger guys can do motorcross because they start at an early age where there parents don't have to spend 1000 for equipment.
They can buy them a 50cc bike for a couple hundred bucks and the kid can go race. As the parents see the kid get more interested they pay more for gear and stuff.
Bikes have a better resale value in NZ than a marker does.
Younger guys have enough other younger guys to race with.
When a newb jumps in paintball he doesn't have a newb tourney he can enter...he jumps straight into the 5's with a spyder and gets raped. (don't feed me "the marker doesn't matter bs either)
Riding motorcross (or any other fairly large extreme sport for that matter) has ALOT of advantages to paintball in the age category.
Burnt Toast
26-02-2006, 09:17
50 cc bikes start at $2000
"50 cc bikes start at $2000"
I suspect not in the 2nd hand maket.
cheers
Younger guys can do motorcross because they start at an early age where there parents don't have to spend 1000 for equipment.
They can buy them a 50cc bike for a couple hundred bucks and the kid can go race. As the parents see the kid get more interested they pay more for gear and stuff.
Bikes have a better resale value in NZ than a marker does.
Younger guys have enough other younger guys to race with.
When a newb jumps in paintball he doesn't have a newb tourney he can enter...he jumps straight into the 5's with a spyder and gets raped. (don't feed me "the marker doesn't matter bs either)
Riding motorcross (or any other fairly large extreme sport for that matter) has ALOT of advantages to paintball in the age category.
I can see where you are coming from but I'm not talking about 50cc Bike's I'm talking about 85cc/125cc Bike's they getting up to big dollar's.. Even second hand be looking round 3g for Bike then another 1g for gear (at the cheap side of thing's) and that's not including travelling, maintenance etc etc.. Bike's need to upgrade every year pretty much a marker you can run for a few year's.. Had a mate who brought a Brand New CRF450 paid 14g spent 2-3g with bling/aftermarket shizz and sold it 2 year's later for 7,800g now that isn't a very good resale factor in my book's..
Right back on topic.. Me personally would prefer to jump in with guy's that had alot of experience with Tourny Style Ball as I think you gain skill's alot quicker by being round them seeing what they do etc etc.. Hell I haven't even played a 3 Man Tourny yet (first one next weekend in Chch) and thank's to B2 I have the chance come Easter to see how the Big Boy's play Ball when I play for Flash Point.. But if a lot of younger guy's started to get interested in Ball I'm sure there could be some sort of age group Tourny or you could even draft them into a Team while Practising etc.. I haven't been playing for long but love the game LOT'S and can see it getting alot bigger down here with the amount of time and effort B2 has been putting into his Paint Ball.. I just hope the sport doesn't fade away cause it's a great game..
Story over :D
Burnt Toast
26-02-2006, 13:03
"50 cc bikes start at $2000"
I suspect not in the 2nd hand maket.
cheers
Your right, $1500 would be closer, or maybe $1200.
I guess the point (which is way off the subject) I was trying to make, is Paintball isn't expensive.
Hey as Stat said blah blah ...
when Hybrid went to Aus we were blamed for killing teams ... funny where not there and its still happening...
Whats happening... herding cats
Now i did run a team for 2 years .. oh the strain and watched it slowly dissapear , why well other teams wanting players
and whats happenend now, well then I believe that there is 3 possible teams that could come out of Auckland if someone would step up and organise them.. Now I know Matty S is doing a great job with new teams
BUt teams have to grow away from fields and other team influences...
Now my team Legion is a throw together too have fun ,we play when ever .. But it is for Fun..
I believe also that due to alot of Bullshit posted ...has disenchanted may peps.. so shut the fu..k up with the dripple
There is no certainy with events anymore Roto was my hi lite and who knows whatit will be this year................
What was you dripple aimed at Sy..
Aimed at ppl stuffing up other teams..or guys trying to get to the base of our issues in ball? I thought you for one would be into it..I guess we all play for fun , no point in playing if it aint fun is there?
B2
The Joka
27-02-2006, 10:45
People need to put their MONEY where their mouth is..... and we all know men are scared of commitment!
There is way too much talk not enough ACTION!
Agree with Both STAT & SY.... Less talk more action!
If you take P.B. back to grass roots and cut out all the crap people will take interest again... As it stands more and more clubs / teams are going to fall over.... People get a headache from banging their head against wall!
Until every single player / club / F.O. / team backs a Governing Body nothing will happen!
Just my $2.00
Cheers
Krazy Mike
27-02-2006, 12:19
Until every single player / club / F.O. / team backs a Governing Body nothing will happen!
Unfortunately there are too many people that have the "not my problem" attitude.
For example: A lot of the rec-ballers seemed, in my opinion, to have the opinion that there is no problem with legal/non-legal tanks as it's a Tourny only issue. They saw it as the Tourny players trying to enforce rules on them. So they worked against it instead of admitting it is a paintball wide issue.
Some people just don't want to work together, they're not happy until they're causing havoc.
The Joka
27-02-2006, 12:37
And that is exactly my point...
Same with Team Stock car racing!
I am only going on hairsay here ..... (So please forgive if I am wrong)
The owner of the Auckland team colours doesn't want to loan them to the team because of a personality clash with one of the drivers!
It is called POLITICS!
Every sport has it just seems to be very prominante in P.B. (excuse spelling)
Peace out!
Burnt Toast
27-02-2006, 12:51
I'm so over this thread, it started out being about getting people into paintball, let try to keep that in mind.
How can we get more people into paintball?
Correct..It was about How do we get ppl in to Ball and those teams that arent attending events how do we get them back..
Which I think we've covered. The consensus was that we need better reffing for a more proffessional image and credibility, and better exposure in the form of advertising (posters at fields, flyers, cards handed out at gun shops).
Also, that some better leadership is required to make it all happen. I guess that's the hard part, but I'm happy to design any advertising material since I'm doing the NZPL stuff anyway. Ref training is slowly getting into gear too.
jazzybrett
27-02-2006, 22:20
So many ideas and good ones are floating around.
Well, how about approaching the teenage TV shows from the TV2,TV3 and so forth and getting them to a game or two, say at Actions for instance.
We get actions to sponsor the games and all the tv companies have to do is film it and play the game on air.
The screening can be done on the normal days they broadcast on.
This should give PaintBall the exposure it surely needs.
This is just an idea and with the proper people to organize this, i am sure it can work.
This has benefited the South African PaintBall scene greatly as a field operator brought about this match against the youth TV people and the paintball scene in SA has taken off big time.
If it worked for them, then boy it sure can for us!!
The whole event was filmed on Hand vidcams and the editting done by the Tv guy's.
Do feel free to reply, it is open to all (your views that is ).
Cheers
Jazzy
waylander
27-02-2006, 23:56
MikeE go contact TVNZ and say we'll film a game and they can edit it and play it. Paintball is exciting so it shouldnt be much of a problem. Right ater Dragonball Z lol
That's the way. I'd probably also contact the likes of Sportscafe - not sure which ones are around and which are not. Surely such whacked out shows would be keen to do a little spot on a neet sport like paintball? Even see if there would be some way to get paintball into something like Performance Car TV - that's a very well refined target market right there who'd lap the stuff up. Assuming we want to attract more of that type of course.
It'd be quite important to manage the image though. Make sure it looks well run and stuff. I know I would say this - but I'd like to see some NZPL banners or something up in the background just to establish some form of brand identity. That way when people see our flyers or posters on the walls of the regular fields they'll be able to connect the two and will see a neet sport which is clearly well run. It'd really raise awareness.
heh, excuse the marketing speak.
"You want paintball in NZ to be noticed world wide? Put paintball in a NZ context, don't make it a carbon copy of the same shit the states do. Make NZ paintball NZ.
I'm not saying hakas, and spearchuckers. Do it our own way."
If we changed everything to be different from the rest of the world, do you HONESTLY think they would care? or do you think they would still not give a shit about NZ? The only way to get recognized overseas is to play overseas, end of. If you ever want to get better or improve this sport you need to take the same steps as the Yanks and start treating this as a sport, not a hobby.
You just need to concentrate on getting more players and teams into the sport.
The whole tv thing is a joke, Grow the community first, The PA league in the UK bought spots on sky sport with money from the entry fees. They had 30 odd teams who were signed up (contract) for 6 tournies making the league.
Jono
For example: A lot of the rec-ballers seemed, in my opinion, to have the opinion that there is no problem with legal/non-legal tanks as it's a Tourny only issue. They saw it as the Tourny players trying to enforce rules on them. So they worked against it instead of admitting it is a paintball wide issue.
Thats because they were ****ing ignorant and had some *people* (I won't name names here) giving them incorrect information who had a financial interest in selling non compliant equipment to them.
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